[SCA-BMDL] Salve Accolens! A Motto for the Debatable Lands

Sat Nov 16 00:02:34 EST 2019

 As was conveyed to Hilda and Bradubh via private email: It was not my
intent to make you or Brandubh look like horrible people for not seeking
further input beyond the August meeting. The way I read your announcement
seemed that an idea was being thrust upon without the populace having
input. My intent was simply to give others opinions and a chance to submit
ideas. The way I read your original post, I read it as you were making this
policy and felt that proper channels should be gone through.

That is all, I wasn't raising a ruckus just to do so, my allegiance is with
the populace, as it was when I served the populace.

In service,
Liam

On Fri, Nov 15, 2019 at 11:45 PM Krista Cogan <krista.cogan at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Master Liam, I am very sorry to have offended you and any others that may
> feel the same. Your wife, Her Excellency Constance, pointed out to me on
> Facebook that my post was not crystal clear that such things are optional.
> In re-reading my blog post from a different point of view, I could
> absolutely see her point, particularly as regards newer people who aren't
> as familiar with the ins and outs of SCA workings. I attempted to correct
> that both here on the email list and Facebook. You then suggested it should
> have been put before the populace more publicly that a discussion at a
> Business meeting (August). That had not been suggested previously to me
> that I can recall, and I hadn't thought of it, but it's a good idea. I
> moved to do just that, tonight.
>
> Since we are doing this publicly, I would say a personal tenet of mine
> publicly: that when someone tells you they are hurt. we do not get to
> decide that they were not hurt. I apologize for hurting you, and others who
> share your thoughts. If there's anything further I can do to rectify,
> beyond taking your and Her Excellency Constance's suggestions, please do
> let me know.
>
> I thank all who have posted some clarifications here on the deeper aspects
> of how we work. They are very much appreciated.
>
> And remember - Mottos are fun! Let's make some fun!
>
> ~Hilda
>
> “Listening is where love begins: listening to ourselves and then to our
> neighbors.” -Fred Rogers
>
> On Fri, Nov 15, 2019 at 11:16 PM Shawn MacIntyre <medicmacintyre at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Personally, I find it discourteous to not bring the idea to the full
>> populace prior to making an announcement. The idea of not allowing the
>> populace to have input prior to making an announcement goes against the
>> proposed motto itself.
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 15, 2019 at 11:09 PM Ruth Morrisson via Sca-bmdl <
>> sca-bmdl at lists.andrew.cmu.edu> wrote:
>>
>>> Greetings from Myfanwy!
>>> I’m in complete agreement with Her Excellency Gwendolyn.
>>> Remember — the SCA does not register full achievements of arms, mottoes,
>>> and the like.  I’m perfectly good with our Baroness suggesting a motto and
>>> letting it be up to the populace to use it or not.  For anyone to suggest
>>> otherwise is discourteous, and completely against everything that the SCA
>>> strives for as an ideal.
>>>
>>> On Nov 15, 2019, at 10:51 PM, Gwenly Grace <gwenlygrace at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Greetings,
>>>
>>> I categorically disagree that the announcement represented a policy
>>> decision. Furthermore, the announcement was clearly invitational in
>>> terminology: "we hope you will join us," etc. To suggest that it was
>>> imperious is, to put it mildly, unkind.
>>>
>>> As a corollary, I don't recall anyone in the populace being consulted or
>>> asked to vote about "Ad gloriam AEthelmearc" (or the original and incorrect
>>> "In Glorias" version)--it was decided by a sitting royal and it was the
>>> task of that royalty to exhort the populace to follow. We did in fact force
>>> a modification, but we could, collectively, have decided "Nope, not doing
>>> that."
>>>
>>> Similarly, if someone writes a song for the barony or the kingdom, it's
>>> not a requirement that the populace adopt it. To me a motto falls in the
>>> same category, and is well within the purview of the Baron and Baroness.
>>>
>>> I have no objection to soliciting suggestions, or asking for a vote, but
>>> I believe the original motto is fitting, and was chosen with only good
>>> intention. But vote or no vote, let's be clear that nothing about this
>>> appears to be a violation of policy.
>>>
>>> Ever in service,
>>>
>>> Gwendolyn the Graceful, Brehyres, OL
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Nov 15, 2019 at 10:29 PM Shawn MacIntyre <
>>> medicmacintyre at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> However, you seem to have already made a decision on your own without
>>>> discussing it at a meeting, your "announcement" was making a policy without
>>>> discussion. It was not pointed out as "Optional" until someone questioned
>>>> the announcement.
>>>>
>>>> Baronial Policy Section I Subsection B,
>>>>
>>>>   B. Baronial policies may be created or changed by the Officers.
>>>> Proposed additions or changes to Baronial policies must appear on the
>>>> agenda of the Officers' meeting at which they are ratified. In this
>>>> circumstance the proposed changes shall be and the agenda shall be
>>>> announced to the populace on the Baronial email list at least 48 hours
>>>> before the meeting.
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Nov 15, 2019 at 10:23 PM Krista Cogan <krista.cogan at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> What an excellent idea! See what we can accomplish together? I wish I
>>>>> would have thought of it myself! Thank you!
>>>>>
>>>>> See, here is the beauty of game side stuff - it's flexy!
>>>>>
>>>>> ~Bns. Hilda
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Nov 15, 2019 at 10:00 PM Shawn MacIntyre <
>>>>> medicmacintyre at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> While the idea of a "Motto" for the Barony may be a great idea, I
>>>>>> have an issue with this not being brought up for public discussion and
>>>>>> chosen by the few, Who had input in the process? I have attended all the
>>>>>> business meetings because they are held at my church. I think a better idea
>>>>>> would be to get input from all the members of the barony, perhaps have a
>>>>>> contest to choose a motto rather than singularly making a decision on
>>>>>> behalf of the populace. While there is a "Game Side" and a" Business Side"
>>>>>> to the SCA, a motto is something that the populace as a whole should
>>>>>> decide. While you point out that the motto is about Love and Acceptance, it
>>>>>> lacks the input of the many, which is the opposite of acceptance. The Hael
>>>>>> and Thescorre's motto have meaning to the populace because they represent
>>>>>> something special that the populace can get behind. Picking a motto is more
>>>>>> like making a campaign saying, while your backers may get behind it,
>>>>>> without a reason to stand by it, it is a saying, not a motto.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Maighstir Liam
>>>>>> 7th Baron of the Barony Marche of the Debatable Lands (Retired)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, Nov 15, 2019 at 4:35 PM Stórfréttir Updates <
>>>>>> admin at debatablelands.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There is new Baronial News at the Stórfréttir!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Salve Accolens! A Motto for the Debatable Lands
>>>>>>> Posted by: Hilderun Hugelman
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Note to those reading from the email list, click on the link below
>>>>>>> to see a formatted version with live links at the blog website. On this,
>>>>>>> the eve of our third Debatable Lands Equestrian Championship (details, and
>>>>>>> schedule), we'd like to introduce to you our new Baronial motto! SALVE
>>>>>>> ACCOLENS! What does it mean? HELLO NEIGHBORS! It is the week of World
>>>>>>> Kindness Day, embodied by the greatest modern champion of kindness and
>>>>>>> courtesy, especially toward oneself and their neighbors: Mr. Fred Rogers.
>>>>>>> The Debatable Lands is his home Barony, and we hope that all our people
>>>>>>> will strive toward these ideals: kindness, courtesy, generous and open
>>>>>>> hearts, mindfulness to feelings, and to be helping and loving and
>>>>>>> welcoming. All these, we feel, are encompassed by "Hello Neighbors" -
>>>>>>> "Salve Accolens". We hope to enact these these ideals in word and deed, and
>>>>>>> hope you all will join us. We are ALL each others' neighbors. SALVE
>>>>>>> ACCOLENS! Please use this new Baronial motto with gusto and verity. (Also,
>>>>>>> it's Latin, so you can say it the other way: ACCOLENS SALVE!) See you at
>>>>>>> Baronial Equestrian Champs tomorrow! In Levitate et Caritate, and
>>>>>>> Cheers,Baron Brandubh and Baroness Hilda "Listening is where love begins:
>>>>>>> listening to ourselves and then to our neighbors." -Fred Rogers
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> To see or comment on this post on the Stórfréttir, click here:
>>>>>>> http://debatablelands.org/blog/?p=4056.
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Sca-bmdl mailing list
>>>>>>> Sca-bmdl at lists.andrew.cmu.edu
>>>>>>> https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-bmdl
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Shawn MacIntyre
>>>>>> EMT/ FFII/ FI-I
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Shawn MacIntyre
>>>> EMT/ FFII/ FI-I
>>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Maistres Myfanwy ferch Rhiannon
>>> Ruth Morrisson
>>> MaistresMyfanwy at icloud.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Shawn MacIntyre
>> EMT/ FFII/ FI-I
>>
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-- 
Shawn MacIntyre
EMT/ FFII/ FI-I
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