From mrio at umich.edu  Fri Jun  7 10:49:45 2013
From: mrio at umich.edu (Monique Rio)
Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2013 10:49:45 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance]  Italian dance workshop suggestions
Message-ID: <CAPY5N8W0S=xx1acAbYeQ5Q7=xAXBc5T+xtfypSYhyzM=8jtiOg@mail.gmail.com>

Going through my backlog of email. I noticed this didn't receive any replies.

Assuming you want beginner friendly and dances found at balls, here
are my recommendations.

15th Century:
Petit Riens
Rostiboli
Amoroso

16th Century
Fedelta (Not actually done much at balls, but I want it to be!! :D )
Contrapasso in Due
Gracca Amorosa

-Jadzia

On Sun, Mar 10, 2013 at 5:41 PM, Charlene Charette
<charlene281 at gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm planning an SCA Italian dance workshop. Out of curiosity, what would be
> your top three 15th C. and top three 16th C. Italian dances? (I have some
> ideas what I want to teach, but I'm interested in hearing what others would
> do.) Assume no prior Italian dance knowledge.
>
> --Perronnelle
> ________________________________________________________________
> To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
> in the To line of any response.
>
> To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
>
> Posting guidlines on the list info page: https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
> ________________________________________________________________

From david.a.learmonth at gmail.com  Fri Jun  7 11:04:22 2013
From: david.a.learmonth at gmail.com (David Learmonth)
Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2013 11:04:22 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Italian dance workshop suggestions
In-Reply-To: <CAPY5N8W0S=xx1acAbYeQ5Q7=xAXBc5T+xtfypSYhyzM=8jtiOg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPY5N8W0S=xx1acAbYeQ5Q7=xAXBc5T+xtfypSYhyzM=8jtiOg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CADxf9v+uUwvanyeLu-sD3faA_n-Taiwz88ShBUQE=Z7v2BrZfw@mail.gmail.com>

I think a few people sent in responses, though it may have been to the same
email, but on a different list.  But I'm sure more suggestions are always
welcome, sounds like some good ones!  :)
Darius


On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 10:49 AM, Monique Rio <mrio at umich.edu> wrote:

> Going through my backlog of email. I noticed this didn't receive any
> replies.
>
> Assuming you want beginner friendly and dances found at balls, here
> are my recommendations.
>
> 15th Century:
> Petit Riens
> Rostiboli
> Amoroso
>
> 16th Century
> Fedelta (Not actually done much at balls, but I want it to be!! :D )
> Contrapasso in Due
> Gracca Amorosa
>
> -Jadzia
>
> On Sun, Mar 10, 2013 at 5:41 PM, Charlene Charette
> <charlene281 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > I'm planning an SCA Italian dance workshop. Out of curiosity, what would
> be
> > your top three 15th C. and top three 16th C. Italian dances? (I have some
> > ideas what I want to teach, but I'm interested in hearing what others
> would
> > do.) Assume no prior Italian dance knowledge.
> >
> > --Perronnelle
> > ________________________________________________________________
> > To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is
> listed
> > in the To line of any response.
> >
> > To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
> >
> > Posting guidlines on the list info page:
> https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
> > ________________________________________________________________
> ________________________________________________________________
> To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
> in the To line of any response.
>
> To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
>
> Posting guidlines on the list info page:
> https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
> ________________________________________________________________
>

From dpeters at panix.com  Fri Jun  7 11:14:39 2013
From: dpeters at panix.com (D. Peters)
Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2013 11:14:39 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Italian dance workshop suggestions
In-Reply-To: <CAPY5N8W0S=xx1acAbYeQ5Q7=xAXBc5T+xtfypSYhyzM=8jtiOg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPY5N8W0S=xx1acAbYeQ5Q7=xAXBc5T+xtfypSYhyzM=8jtiOg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306071112400.23144@panix2.panix.com>

On Fri, 7 Jun 2013, Monique Rio wrote:

> Going through my backlog of email. I noticed this didn't receive any replies.

Actually, it received a lot of replies when it was originally posted 
(3/10/13).  Dunno why it turned up again (there were a couple 
others--something Playford-related--that were also resent)....

Rufina/DP

"Some musicians really fall in love with an instrument and want to live in
the sound of it, but I am more the kind of musician who loves a type of
music and will shamelessly bang away on whatever will get me to that kind
of music...."
      --Shira Kammen

From tmcd at panix.com  Fri Jun  7 11:59:53 2013
From: tmcd at panix.com (Tim McDaniel)
Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2013 10:59:53 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Italian dance workshop suggestions
In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306071112400.23144@panix2.panix.com>
References: <CAPY5N8W0S=xx1acAbYeQ5Q7=xAXBc5T+xtfypSYhyzM=8jtiOg@mail.gmail.com>
	<Pine.NEB.4.64.1306071112400.23144@panix2.panix.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306071057030.29253@panix1.panix.com>

On Fri, 7 Jun 2013, D. Peters <dpeters at panix.com> wrote:
> Actually, it received a lot of replies when it was originally posted
> (3/10/13).  Dunno why it turned up again (there were a couple
> others--something Playford-related--that were also resent)....

A few old postings that I had never seen came out.  I suspect what
happened:
- several people at various times sent postings to the sca-dance list but
   omitted the '[SCA-Dance]' string in the subject
- they got e-mail saying that their messages were being held for
   moderation
- some of them re-sent but adding '[SCA-Dance]'
- the moderator just got around to going thru the
   waiting-for-moderation pile, approving the ones that looked jake

Danihel de Lindocollino
-- 
Tim McDaniel, tmcd at panix.com

From david.a.learmonth at gmail.com  Tue Jun 11 08:01:25 2013
From: david.a.learmonth at gmail.com (David Learmonth)
Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2013 08:01:25 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance]  KWDMS - after hours dancing
Message-ID: <CADxf9vJTZED0OX5p_ixKtGZ4i2bSWLwkfSQ_6vvHHizR9k+MBw@mail.gmail.com>

Dancing after hours? Yes, we have that! Officially from Midnight until 3 am
each of the 3 nights (Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights), we'll be
dancing and goofing around over in the Ballroom at The Inn at Saratoga, not
far from site:
231 Broadway, Saratoga, New York 12866
http://www.theinnatsaratoga.com/

There are even potential plans for a Special Party on Friday night, more
details to come shortly!

Darius


NOTE:  Unfortunately, the rooms have been all booked up for months now.
Some of us grabbed what we could. If anyone is really interested, there are
a few rooms available for just the Thursday and Friday nights, but Not
Saturday. You can get our group rate if you ask for the Known World Dance
Symposium, and that Rob, the General Manager offered to honour our rates
for those nights as well for any add on rooms. (not the cheapest hotel, but
it looks nice, is near by, and hot breakfast included)

From yves.de.fortanier at comcast.net  Wed Jun 12 10:36:26 2013
From: yves.de.fortanier at comcast.net (yves.de.fortanier at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2013 14:36:26 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [SCA-Dance] KWDMS, seeking host for crash space, N. Atlantia / S. EK
In-Reply-To: <605083213.108525.1371045995049.JavaMail.root@sz0113a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1859262241.110155.1371047786675.JavaMail.root@sz0113a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>


Bonjour from Yves, 


KWDMS attendee (male, nonsmoker) seeks kind host for crash space en route to and from event. 


Wednesday night (19th): either along I-95 near Richmond -or- along I-81 between Roanoke and I-66 


Sunday night (23rd): either along I-95 between Philadelphia and Baltimore -or- along I-81 between Scranton and Harrisburg 


If you can help or know someone who could, please respond to me off-list. 


Merci beaucoup en avance! 
Yves de Fortanier 
Meridies 


From david.a.learmonth at gmail.com  Wed Jun 19 01:37:38 2013
From: david.a.learmonth at gmail.com (David Learmonth)
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2013 01:37:38 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance]  KWDMS - Midnight Parties, especially Friday Night
Message-ID: <CADxf9vKH+mOctZZi66q4POYf1uZp_wJrWLSs7fH=zjmGPPCmAQ@mail.gmail.com>

Good evening Dancers,

After the main dancing is finished on Thursday, Friday, and Saturday
evenings, I would invite those who still have energy to join us for
additional dancing (and games perhaps) not far away at The Inn at Saratoga,
in their Ballroom.  If you arrive for Thursday evening, we'll be easy to
find as we are in the building right beside the Thursday night site.

http://www.theinnatsaratoga.com/
231 Broadway, Saratoga, New York 12866

All 3 evenings we have the space for Open Dancing officially from Midnight
until 3 am.  (if we're lucky, we'll start even sooner, depending how
quickly we all get back).

However, on Friday night, we have Additional Plans, a Book of the Courtier!

Here is a link to the description, and being an email, I'll also paste the
description below for convenience.  We hope to see you there!
Darius

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lpIs1b7mlYM8UgvhjA2kdidp1tzqjxZXf-daxaIi9K8/edit?usp=sharing

****************************************
Friday night Book of the Courtier ball
The Book of the Courtier (Il Cortegiano), by Baldessare Castiglione
contains a description of a rather unusual evening in the Court of Urbino.
 Buried therein is much information on what might happen during a more
typical evening.  Among other things, it is clear that a typical evening
involves a good bit of dancing - that this setting is one in which many of
the dances we learn likely were originally done.

On the Friday night of KWDS X, after the main ball we are going to try to
recreate this milieu.  That is, we would try to recreate not just the
dances, but the setting in which they were originally performed - not a
formal ball, but a small, intimate meeting of friends, much as is really
the case here.

There is much similarity between the setting described in Il Cortegiano and
our typical Caroso balls, but there is also more detail.
There is a clear presence, a lord or lady who really does run things.
 Though they may delegate their authority temporarily, it is most
definitely theirs to retain whenever their whim dictates.
People are called upon individually to entertain the company in some
fashion or other.  Even in the games (which sometimes temporarily devolve
into a free-for-all), there is always a reversion to polite serial
monologues.  Please come with the intention of both being entertained and
of entertaining.  Watching is as important a skill as performing, and
performance requires an audience.
As to more practical details, whereas Caroso tells us to segregate by
gender, and arrange ourselves in order of precedence, Castiglione tells us
that gender was alternated as far as possible, and that precedence, with
the exception of the presiding lady herself, was lost or ignored in such an
intimate gathering.

How would one entertain a company of close friends? Our predecessors would
do much the same things we do now - dancing, singing, playing music,
joking, gently teasing each other, and playing games.

We aren?t the first dance geeks.  Dancing is probably the most universal
and popular pastime of the day, referenced in nearly every account of
private parties or gatherings.  However, in this context, it would never be
a social free-for-all.  As we mention above, your purpose in dancing is to
entertain the presence and the company, through grace, or storytelling, or
sheer athleticism.

For those so inclined, a musical performance (vocal and/or instrumental),
would also be a good choice. (Note that the musicians are not paid artists,
but members of the social group.)

Participants could also recite a piece of poetry (original or otherwise) or
a short story or anecdote, or even lead a short game to entertain the
group. Such offerings would add variety to the evening's amusement, and
leave more possibilities for those participants not already highly
specialized in dance and music.

In the original Book of the Courtier, the games are the focus of the book.
 In our recreation, we want to emphasize the other aspects (like dancing!).
 Nevertheless, many of the games described would still be short enough to
be viable.  They tend towards philosophical ?thought experiments,?, and are
often laden with in-jokes.  Examples of these include such gems as ?Why do
all women hate rats and love snakes??, and ?What does the letter ?s? mean
that the Duchess wears on her forehead??, or perhaps even ?Why does Gwommy
always wear purple??  The seem more than anything else to be a simple
vehicle with which to astound the company with one?s wit.

The courtiers of Urbino are long since dead and buried, but their keen wits
and their playful energy live on in us, their spiritual descendants.  Spend
a gracious evening with us, show us your mettle as Renaissance men and
women, and help create another little renaissance of early 16th-century
dance and music culture.

So, when the Friday night ball at KWDMS ends, our celebrated hostess
Countess Thyra Eiriksdottir invites you to while away the late evening in
her salon at the local hostelry:
The Inn at Saratoga (231 Broadway, Saratoga Springs)
****************************************

From mrailing2 at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 19 07:03:01 2013
From: mrailing2 at yahoo.com (Mary Railing)
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2013 04:03:01 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [SCA-Dance] KWDMS - Midnight Parties, especially Friday Night
In-Reply-To: <CADxf9vKH+mOctZZi66q4POYf1uZp_wJrWLSs7fH=zjmGPPCmAQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CADxf9vKH+mOctZZi66q4POYf1uZp_wJrWLSs7fH=zjmGPPCmAQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1371639781.93561.YahooMailNeo@web121803.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>

Does anyone know whether Saratoga Springs is the sort of place where is is going to be *safe* to walk back to one's hotel at 3:00 am? I don't know whether there will be anyone to walk back with, and the more I think about it, the worse the idea of walking alone sounds to me.

--Urraca


________________________________
 From: David Learmonth <david.a.learmonth at gmail.com>
To: sca-dance <sca-dance at sca-dance.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2013 1:37 AM
Subject: [SCA-Dance]  KWDMS - Midnight Parties, especially Friday Night
 

Good evening Dancers,

After the main dancing is finished on Thursday, Friday, and Saturday
evenings, I would invite those who still have energy to join us for
additional dancing (and games perhaps) not far away at The Inn at Saratoga,
in their Ballroom.? If you arrive for Thursday evening, we'll be easy to
find as we are in the building right beside the Thursday night site.

http://www.theinnatsaratoga.com/
231 Broadway, Saratoga, New York 12866

All 3 evenings we have the space for Open Dancing officially from Midnight
until 3 am.? (if we're lucky, we'll start even sooner, depending how
quickly we all get back).

However, on Friday night, we have Additional Plans, a Book of the Courtier!

Here is a link to the description, and being an email, I'll also paste the
description below for convenience.? We hope to see you there!
Darius

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lpIs1b7mlYM8UgvhjA2kdidp1tzqjxZXf-daxaIi9K8/edit?usp=sharing

****************************************
Friday night Book of the Courtier ball
The Book of the Courtier (Il Cortegiano), by Baldessare Castiglione
contains a description of a rather unusual evening in the Court of Urbino.
Buried therein is much information on what might happen during a more
typical evening.? Among other things, it is clear that a typical evening
involves a good bit of dancing - that this setting is one in which many of
the dances we learn likely were originally done.

On the Friday night of KWDS X, after the main ball we are going to try to
recreate this milieu.? That is, we would try to recreate not just the
dances, but the setting in which they were originally performed - not a
formal ball, but a small, intimate meeting of friends, much as is really
the case here.

There is much similarity between the setting described in Il Cortegiano and
our typical Caroso balls, but there is also more detail.
There is a clear presence, a lord or lady who really does run things.
Though they may delegate their authority temporarily, it is most
definitely theirs to retain whenever their whim dictates.
People are called upon individually to entertain the company in some
fashion or other.? Even in the games (which sometimes temporarily devolve
into a free-for-all), there is always a reversion to polite serial
monologues.? Please come with the intention of both being entertained and
of entertaining.? Watching is as important a skill as performing, and
performance requires an audience.
As to more practical details, whereas Caroso tells us to segregate by
gender, and arrange ourselves in order of precedence, Castiglione tells us
that gender was alternated as far as possible, and that precedence, with
the exception of the presiding lady herself, was lost or ignored in such an
intimate gathering.

How would one entertain a company of close friends? Our predecessors would
do much the same things we do now - dancing, singing, playing music,
joking, gently teasing each other, and playing games.

We aren?t the first dance geeks.? Dancing is probably the most universal
and popular pastime of the day, referenced in nearly every account of
private parties or gatherings.? However, in this context, it would never be
a social free-for-all.? As we mention above, your purpose in dancing is to
entertain the presence and the company, through grace, or storytelling, or
sheer athleticism.

For those so inclined, a musical performance (vocal and/or instrumental),
would also be a good choice. (Note that the musicians are not paid artists,
but members of the social group.)

Participants could also recite a piece of poetry (original or otherwise) or
a short story or anecdote, or even lead a short game to entertain the
group. Such offerings would add variety to the evening's amusement, and
leave more possibilities for those participants not already highly
specialized in dance and music.

In the original Book of the Courtier, the games are the focus of the book.
In our recreation, we want to emphasize the other aspects (like dancing!).
Nevertheless, many of the games described would still be short enough to
be viable.? They tend towards philosophical ?thought experiments,?, and are
often laden with in-jokes.? Examples of these include such gems as ?Why do
all women hate rats and love snakes??, and ?What does the letter ?s? mean
that the Duchess wears on her forehead??, or perhaps even ?Why does Gwommy
always wear purple??? The seem more than anything else to be a simple
vehicle with which to astound the company with one?s wit.

The courtiers of Urbino are long since dead and buried, but their keen wits
and their playful energy live on in us, their spiritual descendants.? Spend
a gracious evening with us, show us your mettle as Renaissance men and
women, and help create another little renaissance of early 16th-century
dance and music culture.

So, when the Friday night ball at KWDMS ends, our celebrated hostess
Countess Thyra Eiriksdottir invites you to while away the late evening in
her salon at the local hostelry:
The Inn at Saratoga (231 Broadway, Saratoga Springs)
****************************************
________________________________________________________________
To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
in the To line of any response.

To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org

Posting guidlines on the list info page: https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
________________________________________________________________

From mrailing2 at yahoo.com  Wed Jun 19 07:13:01 2013
From: mrailing2 at yahoo.com (Mary Railing)
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2013 04:13:01 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [SCA-Dance] KWDMS - Midnight Parties, especially Friday Night
In-Reply-To: <CADxf9vKH+mOctZZi66q4POYf1uZp_wJrWLSs7fH=zjmGPPCmAQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CADxf9vKH+mOctZZi66q4POYf1uZp_wJrWLSs7fH=zjmGPPCmAQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1371640381.60221.YahooMailNeo@web121805.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>

Countess Mara hosted such an affair at the KWDS in Boston in the lounge of the dorm we were staying in. It was mostly a sort of bardic circle where the lady in charge got to ask people to perform. It was very interesting, although it gave me a greater respect for those courtiers who lived by their charm and wit.

--Urraca


________________________________
 From: David Learmonth <david.a.learmonth at gmail.com>
To: sca-dance <sca-dance at sca-dance.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2013 1:37 AM
Subject: [SCA-Dance]  KWDMS - Midnight Parties, especially Friday Night
 

Good evening Dancers,

After the main dancing is finished on Thursday, Friday, and Saturday
evenings, I would invite those who still have energy to join us for
additional dancing (and games perhaps) not far away at The Inn at Saratoga,
in their Ballroom.? If you arrive for Thursday evening, we'll be easy to
find as we are in the building right beside the Thursday night site.

http://www.theinnatsaratoga.com/
231 Broadway, Saratoga, New York 12866

All 3 evenings we have the space for Open Dancing officially from Midnight
until 3 am.? (if we're lucky, we'll start even sooner, depending how
quickly we all get back).

However, on Friday night, we have Additional Plans, a Book of the Courtier!

Here is a link to the description, and being an email, I'll also paste the
description below for convenience.? We hope to see you there!
Darius

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lpIs1b7mlYM8UgvhjA2kdidp1tzqjxZXf-daxaIi9K8/edit?usp=sharing

****************************************
Friday night Book of the Courtier ball
The Book of the Courtier (Il Cortegiano), by Baldessare Castiglione
contains a description of a rather unusual evening in the Court of Urbino.
Buried therein is much information on what might happen during a more
typical evening.? Among other things, it is clear that a typical evening
involves a good bit of dancing - that this setting is one in which many of
the dances we learn likely were originally done.

On the Friday night of KWDS X, after the main ball we are going to try to
recreate this milieu.? That is, we would try to recreate not just the
dances, but the setting in which they were originally performed - not a
formal ball, but a small, intimate meeting of friends, much as is really
the case here.

There is much similarity between the setting described in Il Cortegiano and
our typical Caroso balls, but there is also more detail.
There is a clear presence, a lord or lady who really does run things.
Though they may delegate their authority temporarily, it is most
definitely theirs to retain whenever their whim dictates.
People are called upon individually to entertain the company in some
fashion or other.? Even in the games (which sometimes temporarily devolve
into a free-for-all), there is always a reversion to polite serial
monologues.? Please come with the intention of both being entertained and
of entertaining.? Watching is as important a skill as performing, and
performance requires an audience.
As to more practical details, whereas Caroso tells us to segregate by
gender, and arrange ourselves in order of precedence, Castiglione tells us
that gender was alternated as far as possible, and that precedence, with
the exception of the presiding lady herself, was lost or ignored in such an
intimate gathering.

How would one entertain a company of close friends? Our predecessors would
do much the same things we do now - dancing, singing, playing music,
joking, gently teasing each other, and playing games.

We aren?t the first dance geeks.? Dancing is probably the most universal
and popular pastime of the day, referenced in nearly every account of
private parties or gatherings.? However, in this context, it would never be
a social free-for-all.? As we mention above, your purpose in dancing is to
entertain the presence and the company, through grace, or storytelling, or
sheer athleticism.

For those so inclined, a musical performance (vocal and/or instrumental),
would also be a good choice. (Note that the musicians are not paid artists,
but members of the social group.)

Participants could also recite a piece of poetry (original or otherwise) or
a short story or anecdote, or even lead a short game to entertain the
group. Such offerings would add variety to the evening's amusement, and
leave more possibilities for those participants not already highly
specialized in dance and music.

In the original Book of the Courtier, the games are the focus of the book.
In our recreation, we want to emphasize the other aspects (like dancing!).
Nevertheless, many of the games described would still be short enough to
be viable.? They tend towards philosophical ?thought experiments,?, and are
often laden with in-jokes.? Examples of these include such gems as ?Why do
all women hate rats and love snakes??, and ?What does the letter ?s? mean
that the Duchess wears on her forehead??, or perhaps even ?Why does Gwommy
always wear purple??? The seem more than anything else to be a simple
vehicle with which to astound the company with one?s wit.

The courtiers of Urbino are long since dead and buried, but their keen wits
and their playful energy live on in us, their spiritual descendants.? Spend
a gracious evening with us, show us your mettle as Renaissance men and
women, and help create another little renaissance of early 16th-century
dance and music culture.

So, when the Friday night ball at KWDMS ends, our celebrated hostess
Countess Thyra Eiriksdottir invites you to while away the late evening in
her salon at the local hostelry:
The Inn at Saratoga (231 Broadway, Saratoga Springs)
****************************************
________________________________________________________________
To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
in the To line of any response.

To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org

Posting guidlines on the list info page: https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
________________________________________________________________

From david.a.learmonth at gmail.com  Wed Jun 19 08:17:27 2013
From: david.a.learmonth at gmail.com (David Learmonth)
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2013 08:17:27 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] KWDMS - Midnight Parties, especially Friday Night
In-Reply-To: <1371639781.93561.YahooMailNeo@web121803.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
References: <CADxf9vKH+mOctZZi66q4POYf1uZp_wJrWLSs7fH=zjmGPPCmAQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<1371639781.93561.YahooMailNeo@web121803.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CADxf9vLDpTuRL_Gc8-2TPoJwhcE56ZQKf6NcKXFrH6cO4=+a7g@mail.gmail.com>

I don't know off hand.  However, the distance from The Inn at Saratoga, to
the Saratoga Downtowner, where many people are staying, is listed as 0.4
Miles on Google Maps, or 9 minutes walk, and it is a straight shot on the
same street, Broadway.

I think we'll just have to set up a Walk.  People can leave in groups, and
if need be, some of us can walk, or drive, people back at the end of the
evening.  I'll volunteer to help out.

Same basic rules as Pennsic, but hopefully without as large a hill to
scale.  :)

Darius



On Wed, Jun 19, 2013 at 7:03 AM, Mary Railing <mrailing2 at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Does anyone know whether Saratoga Springs is the sort of place where is is
> going to be *safe* to walk back to one's hotel at 3:00 am? I don't know
> whether there will be anyone to walk back with, and the more I think about
> it, the worse the idea of walking alone sounds to me.
>
> --Urraca
>
>
> ________________________________
>  From: David Learmonth <david.a.learmonth at gmail.com>
> To: sca-dance <sca-dance at sca-dance.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2013 1:37 AM
> Subject: [SCA-Dance]  KWDMS - Midnight Parties, especially Friday Night
>
>
> Good evening Dancers,
>
> After the main dancing is finished on Thursday, Friday, and Saturday
> evenings, I would invite those who still have energy to join us for
> additional dancing (and games perhaps) not far away at The Inn at Saratoga,
> in their Ballroom.  If you arrive for Thursday evening, we'll be easy to
> find as we are in the building right beside the Thursday night site.
>
> http://www.theinnatsaratoga.com/
> 231 Broadway, Saratoga, New York 12866
>
> All 3 evenings we have the space for Open Dancing officially from Midnight
> until 3 am.  (if we're lucky, we'll start even sooner, depending how
> quickly we all get back).
>
> However, on Friday night, we have Additional Plans, a Book of the Courtier!
>
> Here is a link to the description, and being an email, I'll also paste the
> description below for convenience.  We hope to see you there!
> Darius
>
>
> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lpIs1b7mlYM8UgvhjA2kdidp1tzqjxZXf-daxaIi9K8/edit?usp=sharing
>
> ****************************************
> Friday night Book of the Courtier ball
> The Book of the Courtier (Il Cortegiano), by Baldessare Castiglione
> contains a description of a rather unusual evening in the Court of Urbino.
> Buried therein is much information on what might happen during a more
> typical evening.  Among other things, it is clear that a typical evening
> involves a good bit of dancing - that this setting is one in which many of
> the dances we learn likely were originally done.
>
> On the Friday night of KWDS X, after the main ball we are going to try to
> recreate this milieu.  That is, we would try to recreate not just the
> dances, but the setting in which they were originally performed - not a
> formal ball, but a small, intimate meeting of friends, much as is really
> the case here.
>
> There is much similarity between the setting described in Il Cortegiano and
> our typical Caroso balls, but there is also more detail.
> There is a clear presence, a lord or lady who really does run things.
> Though they may delegate their authority temporarily, it is most
> definitely theirs to retain whenever their whim dictates.
> People are called upon individually to entertain the company in some
> fashion or other.  Even in the games (which sometimes temporarily devolve
> into a free-for-all), there is always a reversion to polite serial
> monologues.  Please come with the intention of both being entertained and
> of entertaining.  Watching is as important a skill as performing, and
> performance requires an audience.
> As to more practical details, whereas Caroso tells us to segregate by
> gender, and arrange ourselves in order of precedence, Castiglione tells us
> that gender was alternated as far as possible, and that precedence, with
> the exception of the presiding lady herself, was lost or ignored in such an
> intimate gathering.
>
> How would one entertain a company of close friends? Our predecessors would
> do much the same things we do now - dancing, singing, playing music,
> joking, gently teasing each other, and playing games.
>
> We aren?t the first dance geeks.  Dancing is probably the most universal
> and popular pastime of the day, referenced in nearly every account of
> private parties or gatherings.  However, in this context, it would never be
> a social free-for-all.  As we mention above, your purpose in dancing is to
> entertain the presence and the company, through grace, or storytelling, or
> sheer athleticism.
>
> For those so inclined, a musical performance (vocal and/or instrumental),
> would also be a good choice. (Note that the musicians are not paid artists,
> but members of the social group.)
>
> Participants could also recite a piece of poetry (original or otherwise) or
> a short story or anecdote, or even lead a short game to entertain the
> group. Such offerings would add variety to the evening's amusement, and
> leave more possibilities for those participants not already highly
> specialized in dance and music.
>
> In the original Book of the Courtier, the games are the focus of the book.
> In our recreation, we want to emphasize the other aspects (like dancing!).
> Nevertheless, many of the games described would still be short enough to
> be viable.  They tend towards philosophical ?thought experiments,?, and are
> often laden with in-jokes.  Examples of these include such gems as ?Why do
> all women hate rats and love snakes??, and ?What does the letter ?s? mean
> that the Duchess wears on her forehead??, or perhaps even ?Why does Gwommy
> always wear purple??  The seem more than anything else to be a simple
> vehicle with which to astound the company with one?s wit.
>
> The courtiers of Urbino are long since dead and buried, but their keen wits
> and their playful energy live on in us, their spiritual descendants.  Spend
> a gracious evening with us, show us your mettle as Renaissance men and
> women, and help create another little renaissance of early 16th-century
> dance and music culture.
>
> So, when the Friday night ball at KWDMS ends, our celebrated hostess
> Countess Thyra Eiriksdottir invites you to while away the late evening in
> her salon at the local hostelry:
> The Inn at Saratoga (231 Broadway, Saratoga Springs)
> ****************************************
> ________________________________________________________________
> To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
> in the To line of any response.
>
> To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
>
> Posting guidlines on the list info page:
> https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
> ________________________________________________________________
> ________________________________________________________________
> To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
> in the To line of any response.
>
> To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
>
> Posting guidlines on the list info page:
> https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
> ________________________________________________________________

From alexbclark at pennswoods.net  Thu Jun 20 09:12:35 2013
From: alexbclark at pennswoods.net (Alexander Clark)
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2013 09:12:35 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance]  Ripresa graue
Message-ID: <CAKWJ1s0svadcEfW74LKvJdPtQFX0nkm6Ddd+FN277N0U--VJbg@mail.gmail.com>

I was just reviewing some steps and looked over something I'd been
thinking I ought to share. The translation at
http://jducoeur.org/IlBallarino/Book1/Riprese.html seems to be missing
a word. The original says "dopo" (which means "then") before the part
about raising the heels, so it ought to be translated, "and then
raising both the heels . . ." So you step out to the side, then rise
up.

ISTM that it's kind of usual for SCA dancers to rise up (with the
heels up) before stepping out to the side, as is not really ruled out
by this translation. Could this be where we got it from?

--
Henry/Alex

From jducoeur at gmail.com  Thu Jun 20 12:41:36 2013
From: jducoeur at gmail.com (Justin du coeur)
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2013 12:41:36 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Ripresa graue
In-Reply-To: <CAKWJ1s0svadcEfW74LKvJdPtQFX0nkm6Ddd+FN277N0U--VJbg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKWJ1s0svadcEfW74LKvJdPtQFX0nkm6Ddd+FN277N0U--VJbg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO26FW3QOUEnvftaDkHrAo2ba+texVdnmccBjgt+JXn_-tzeXg@mail.gmail.com>

Seems unlikely -- I was seeing the up-then-over sometimes before Clara's
translation came out.  (We've generally done the over-then-up ourselves
since then.)  So I think it's an older habit...


On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 9:12 AM, Alexander Clark
<alexbclark at pennswoods.net>wrote:

> I was just reviewing some steps and looked over something I'd been
> thinking I ought to share. The translation at
> http://jducoeur.org/IlBallarino/Book1/Riprese.html seems to be missing
> a word. The original says "dopo" (which means "then") before the part
> about raising the heels, so it ought to be translated, "and then
> raising both the heels . . ." So you step out to the side, then rise
> up.
>
> ISTM that it's kind of usual for SCA dancers to rise up (with the
> heels up) before stepping out to the side, as is not really ruled out
> by this translation. Could this be where we got it from?
>
> --
> Henry/Alex
> ________________________________________________________________
> To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
> in the To line of any response.
>
> To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
>
> Posting guidlines on the list info page:
> https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
> ________________________________________________________________
>

From mrailing2 at yahoo.com  Thu Jun 20 13:09:44 2013
From: mrailing2 at yahoo.com (Mary Railing)
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2013 10:09:44 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Ripresa graue
In-Reply-To: <CAKWJ1s0svadcEfW74LKvJdPtQFX0nkm6Ddd+FN277N0U--VJbg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1371748184.18674.YahooMailMobile@web121804.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>

I got my ideas about how to do a ripresa from workshops taught by Julia Sutton, Angene Feves and Charles Garth (they did them differently) long before there was a translation of Il Ballarino. I think I was most influenced by Angene Feves. I started reading Il  Ballarino before the internet era. I had to go to the IU library and copy the step rules by hand (because the facsimile did not circulate) and translate them myself-- and I had to walk uphill both ways in the snow to get there . . . ;-)

-Urraca

From greenguy at peculiarity.net  Thu Jun 20 15:56:09 2013
From: greenguy at peculiarity.net (Jeremy Kessler)
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2013 15:56:09 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Ripresa graue
In-Reply-To: <1371748184.18674.YahooMailMobile@web121804.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
References: <1371748184.18674.YahooMailMobile@web121804.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <assp.9883a8de66.f2f2f71db970e8f1314abb9bd026f081@arberth.com>

Urraca,

> and I had to walk uphill both ways in the snow to get there

So did you walk uphill and then over, or did you walk over and then 
uphill?  Enquiring minds want to know!

For the record, I think the first time I was taught how to do a ripresa 
the idea was to go up, over, and down so as to emulate the golden arches 
of McDonalds.  That was a very long time ago.

Phelan


From jducoeur at gmail.com  Thu Jun 20 16:07:35 2013
From: jducoeur at gmail.com (Justin du coeur)
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2013 16:07:35 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Ripresa graue
In-Reply-To: <assp.9883a8de66.f2f2f71db970e8f1314abb9bd026f081@arberth.com>
References: <1371748184.18674.YahooMailMobile@web121804.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
	<assp.9883a8de66.f2f2f71db970e8f1314abb9bd026f081@arberth.com>
Message-ID: <CAO26FW28Ngnf08RFc6hrvecvJb5DzWH552F3daemcKupD=Bsnw@mail.gmail.com>

Hmm.  The McDonald's allusion aside, that's exactly the standard Brainard
interpretation of the 15th century Contenenza.  Given that folks often make
the hand-waving comparison that the 15th and 16th century riprese and
continenze kind of swapped places, I can see folks interpreting the 16th
century ripresa minima as essentially a 15th century continenza.  And from
there, it's not much of a leap to use the same motion for the ripresa grave.

That's just a guess, but it's a fairly plausible explanation -- that sort
of game of telephone is pretty common in the SCA...


On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 3:56 PM, Jeremy Kessler <greenguy at peculiarity.net>wrote:

> Urraca,
>
> > and I had to walk uphill both ways in the snow to get there
>
> So did you walk uphill and then over, or did you walk over and then
> uphill?  Enquiring minds want to know!
>
> For the record, I think the first time I was taught how to do a ripresa
> the idea was to go up, over, and down so as to emulate the golden arches
> of McDonalds.  That was a very long time ago.
>
> Phelan
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
> in the To line of any response.
>
> To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
>
> Posting guidlines on the list info page:
> https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
> ________________________________________________________________
>

From david.a.learmonth at gmail.com  Wed Jun 19 01:33:50 2013
From: david.a.learmonth at gmail.com (David Learmonth)
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2013 01:33:50 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] KWDMS - Midnight Parties, especially Friday Night
Message-ID: <CADxf9vK4iJmjiKP7KY2vhAyLwVQhXOvVecefPCkTuFm_n4d1bw@mail.gmail.com>

Good evening Dancers,

After the main dancing is finished on Thursday, Friday, and Saturday
evenings, I would invite those who still have energy to join us for
additional dancing (and games perhaps) not far away at The Inn at Saratoga,
in their Ballroom.  If you arrive for Thursday evening, we'll be easy to
find as we are in the building right beside the Thursday night site.

http://www.theinnatsaratoga.com/
231 Broadway, Saratoga, New York 12866

All 3 evenings we have the space for Open Dancing officially from Midnight
until 3 am.  (if we're lucky, we'll start even sooner, depending how
quickly we all get back).

However, on Friday night, we have Additional Plans, a Book of the Courtier!

Here is a link to the description, and being an email, I'll also paste the
description below for convenience.  We hope to see you there!
Darius

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lpIs1b7mlYM8UgvhjA2kdidp1tzqjxZXf-daxaIi9K8/edit?usp=sharing

****************************************
Friday night Book of the Courtier ball
The Book of the Courtier (Il Cortegiano), by Baldessare Castiglione
contains a description of a rather unusual evening in the Court of Urbino.
 Buried therein is much information on what might happen during a more
typical evening.  Among other things, it is clear that a typical evening
involves a good bit of dancing - that this setting is one in which many of
the dances we learn likely were originally done.

On the Friday night of KWDS X, after the main ball we are going to try to
recreate this milieu.  That is, we would try to recreate not just the
dances, but the setting in which they were originally performed - not a
formal ball, but a small, intimate meeting of friends, much as is really
the case here.

There is much similarity between the setting described in Il Cortegiano and
our typical Caroso balls, but there is also more detail.
There is a clear presence, a lord or lady who really does run things.
 Though they may delegate their authority temporarily, it is most
definitely theirs to retain whenever their whim dictates.
People are called upon individually to entertain the company in some
fashion or other.  Even in the games (which sometimes temporarily devolve
into a free-for-all), there is always a reversion to polite serial
monologues.  Please come with the intention of both being entertained and
of entertaining.  Watching is as important a skill as performing, and
performance requires an audience.
As to more practical details, whereas Caroso tells us to segregate by
gender, and arrange ourselves in order of precedence, Castiglione tells us
that gender was alternated as far as possible, and that precedence, with
the exception of the presiding lady herself, was lost or ignored in such an
intimate gathering.

How would one entertain a company of close friends? Our predecessors would
do much the same things we do now - dancing, singing, playing music,
joking, gently teasing each other, and playing games.

We aren?t the first dance geeks.  Dancing is probably the most universal
and popular pastime of the day, referenced in nearly every account of
private parties or gatherings.  However, in this context, it would never be
a social free-for-all.  As we mention above, your purpose in dancing is to
entertain the presence and the company, through grace, or storytelling, or
sheer athleticism.

For those so inclined, a musical performance (vocal and/or instrumental),
would also be a good choice. (Note that the musicians are not paid artists,
but members of the social group.)

Participants could also recite a piece of poetry (original or otherwise) or
a short story or anecdote, or even lead a short game to entertain the
group. Such offerings would add variety to the evening's amusement, and
leave more possibilities for those participants not already highly
specialized in dance and music.

In the original Book of the Courtier, the games are the focus of the book.
 In our recreation, we want to emphasize the other aspects (like dancing!).
 Nevertheless, many of the games described would still be short enough to
be viable.  They tend towards philosophical ?thought experiments,?, and are
often laden with in-jokes.  Examples of these include such gems as ?Why do
all women hate rats and love snakes??, and ?What does the letter ?s? mean
that the Duchess wears on her forehead??, or perhaps even ?Why does Gwommy
always wear purple??  The seem more than anything else to be a simple
vehicle with which to astound the company with one?s wit.

The courtiers of Urbino are long since dead and buried, but their keen wits
and their playful energy live on in us, their spiritual descendants.  Spend
a gracious evening with us, show us your mettle as Renaissance men and
women, and help create another little renaissance of early 16th-century
dance and music culture.

So, when the Friday night ball at KWDMS ends, our celebrated hostess
Countess Thyra Eiriksdottir invites you to while away the late evening in
her salon at the local hostelry:
The Inn at Saratoga (231 Broadway, Saratoga Springs)
****************************************

From pennsic.eurodance at gmail.com  Sun Jun 23 20:45:16 2013
From: pennsic.eurodance at gmail.com (European Dance Pennsic War)
Date: Sun, 23 Jun 2013 20:45:16 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance]  Dance Practices of the Known World
Message-ID: <CAB-WBxRakqQnoAYhu41tu3sx9p916MMDCQt4qFg3GaDVLzNUSA@mail.gmail.com>

Greetings unto the SCA Dance Community!  I thought I had sent the following
email here before, but it appears to have been lost to the mists, so I hope
you will accept my apologies.

Last year, Lady Sonya Flickr (Patches) came forward with a fantastic idea:
a map of the Known World with all regular local dance practices marked on
it!  To this end, we have come up with a list of the known dance practices,
based upon our own knowledge and the information available on local groups'
websites, but I don't want to miss any.  So, if you have a regular practice
as part of your local group or you know where there is one nearby, please
go check the list to see if its on it:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/pub?key=0AptOtfNQcJ1XdGNRYVlrbkl2LUJ6OFU3SUx6VzlENVE&output=html

If your practice is missing from this list, please contact me with the
necessary information at
pennsic.eurodance at gmail.com.

Thanks for everyone's help!
Margaret


THL Margherita Battistina (Margaret Roe)
Dean of the School of European Dance, Pennsic 42

From tmcd at panix.com  Mon Jun 24 11:56:49 2013
From: tmcd at panix.com (Tim McDaniel)
Date: Mon, 24 Jun 2013 10:56:49 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [SCA-Dance]  Well??
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306241052100.4348@panix3.panix.com>

KWDMS should have happened this last weekend.  Were reputations made?
Were reputations ruined?  Did someone find the Secret Decoder Ring for
the Gresley dances?  Did someone find a magic spell to make Burgundian
basse dances interesting?  (Two lowfat mice, please, hold the cream;
I'm on a diet.)  Did it come off OK?

Danihel de Lindonio
-- 
Tim McDaniel, tmcd at panix.com

From mrailing2 at yahoo.com  Mon Jun 24 13:38:54 2013
From: mrailing2 at yahoo.com (Mary Railing)
Date: Mon, 24 Jun 2013 13:38:54 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Well??
In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306241052100.4348@panix3.panix.com>
References: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306241052100.4348@panix3.panix.com>
Message-ID: <DFB5E2EC-6EA2-459C-8ABC-A23A903DA456@yahoo.com>

Yes. No. Yes. Maybe. Yes. However, I am too tired to write about it yet. More after I have a chance to rest from a loooong drive.

-Urraca



On Jun 24, 2013, at 11:56 AM, Tim McDaniel <tmcd at panix.com> wrote:

> KWDMS should have happened this last weekend.  Were reputations made?
> Were reputations ruined?  Did someone find the Secret Decoder Ring for
> the Gresley dances?  Did someone find a magic spell to make Burgundian
> basse dances interesting?  (Two lowfat mice, please, hold the cream;
> I'm on a diet.)  Did it come off OK?
> 
> Danihel de Lindonio
> -- 
> Tim McDaniel, tmcd at panix.com
> ________________________________________________________________
> To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
> in the To line of any response.
> 
> To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
> 
> Posting guidlines on the list info page: https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
> _____________________________________________________________

From dpeters at panix.com  Mon Jun 24 14:20:59 2013
From: dpeters at panix.com (D. Peters)
Date: Mon, 24 Jun 2013 14:20:59 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Bassedanses
In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306241052100.4348@panix3.panix.com>
References: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306241052100.4348@panix3.panix.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306241416320.2349@panix2.panix.com>

On Mon, 24 Jun 2013, Tim McDaniel wrote:

> Did someone find a magic spell to make Burgundian basse dances 
> interesting?

Actually, I've *always* found Burgundian bassedanses interesting--but I'm 
more of a musician than a dancer, and I love fifteenth-century 
instrumental music.  The first time that I saw Casseulle, danced to a 
four-part Spagna setting, I was hooked :-)

(And it's always seemed to me that an imaginative dancer can make just 
about any type of dance interesting, in any case....)

Cheers--
Rufina/DP

"Some musicians really fall in love with an instrument and want to live in
the sound of it, but I am more the kind of musician who loves a type of
music and will shamelessly bang away on whatever will get me to that kind
of music...."
      --Shira Kammen

From jducoeur at gmail.com  Mon Jun 24 15:50:52 2013
From: jducoeur at gmail.com (Justin du coeur)
Date: Mon, 24 Jun 2013 15:50:52 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Bassedanses
In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306241416320.2349@panix2.panix.com>
References: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306241052100.4348@panix3.panix.com>
	<Pine.NEB.4.64.1306241416320.2349@panix2.panix.com>
Message-ID: <CAO26FW25321QBoCf7UsCNTkzAgWqKhL-EyMkKKH4Q+yA1hVaxQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Jun 24, 2013 at 2:20 PM, D. Peters <dpeters at panix.com> wrote:

> On Mon, 24 Jun 2013, Tim McDaniel wrote:
>
> > Did someone find a magic spell to make Burgundian basse dances
> > interesting?
>
> Actually, I've *always* found Burgundian bassedanses interesting--but I'm
> more of a musician than a dancer, and I love fifteenth-century
> instrumental music.  The first time that I saw Casseulle, danced to a
> four-part Spagna setting, I was hooked :-)
>
> (And it's always seemed to me that an imaginative dancer can make just
> about any type of dance interesting, in any case....)


Actually, this raises an interesting question: why *do* we seem to disagree
with our period forebears about Burgundian dance?

This ties into one of my commonplace observations about period: people are
basically people, and period people weren't *that* different from us.  For
example, my rule of thumb in cooking is that, if my reconstructed recipe
tastes vile, I probably did it wrong.  Of course, I don't judge that solely
by myself -- tastes vary -- but if *everybody* thinks it's vile then I'm
pretty suspicious.  I almost always find an alternate interpretation that
works better.

The same logic seems to apply for dance.  While there were many subtle
forces in period dance, by and large people did it because it was
enjoyable.  I've seen little evidence that dances tended to survive if they
weren't at least *somewhat* fun.

So if we seem to consistently find Burgundian dance dull, that sings out to
me that we're doing *something* wrong.  Could be the reconstructions; could
be that we're being too rigid in the interpretations of the style, not
giving ourselves enough latitude to mess around; might even be that our
*mindset* is simply wrong -- we might be over-thinking dances that were
deliberately simple so that people could socialize during them.

I'm honestly unsure what the answer is here.  It just occurs to me that
these dances are attested by several different period manuals, so we have
good reason to believe they were popular.  If that's the case, then I have
to believe that the period dancers didn't find them a chore.  So if we *do*
find them dishpan-dull, we're probably doing something wrong...

From mrailing2 at yahoo.com  Tue Jun 25 22:42:22 2013
From: mrailing2 at yahoo.com (Mary Railing)
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2013 19:42:22 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [SCA-Dance] kwdms wrap-up
In-Reply-To: <BLU173-W1708832EA7B0C892873B0EC5960@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU173-W1708832EA7B0C892873B0EC5960@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <1372214542.40778.YahooMailNeo@web121802.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>

These are my (not always coherent) notes from the wrap-up meeting:

Good things
?? The Renaissonics: They were thrilled to come. We were thrilled to have them. Grant money from the corporation was used to pay them ($250 a person plus expenses). There is a grant from Master Christopher Darras [sp?] available for bringing professionals to teach at KWDMS.
?? The music classes: The coordinator asked for suggestions of what people wanted to learn. Therefore there were good, well-attended classes.?
? ?Food:? There was a good food Friday and Saturday, including vegan. Deonna liked that she could tell them what she was looking for, and they knew just what to do.
? ?Pick up bands: Johannes liked being able to play in the pick-up band. He would have liked more practice time, but that was a scheduling issue.
? ?Web site: Gwommy made user-friendly web site.?
? ?Most people liked the long breaks between classes. They were necessary to go between buildings. There was some discussion regarding the optimal number of tracks and class periods.?

Not so good
?? ?Lost the? Middle Eastern track.
?? There was a practice room with sheet music available, but most people didn't know about it. It would have been better to have had the music available before the event, so people could practice it, but Deonna didn't have enough advance info on ball sets.?
?? The ball sets needed modification. Do not need to have every dance that was taught in the ball.
? ?People would have liked more class info on the web sooner. Knowing what classes were on which day would be helpful for someone trying to decide if they should skip work to go on Friday. People liked having aerobic level and complexity level listed, although that had been a controversial suggestion previously.
?? Proceedings: There weren't a lot of contributions. The editor wants to add class handouts to the electronic version. Important to set early deadlines and then ask people personally. APhillip lot seems to depend on who knows who. Deonna noted that there is only so much one can do to inform people about deadlines People need to read the web site.?

Drachenwald in 2015: Urraca described Countess Judith's proposal for a KWDMS in Miltenberg, Germany. The site would be the Altes Rathaus (city hall) which has been used for dance events before. There is also a nearby hostel, which could be used for classes as well as lodging. The biggest variable is the date. Their kingdom's dance event is usually held in March, which is when Judith would prefer, but KWDMS is usually in June or early July. People in the room seemed pretty evenly split as to which month they would prefer (although comments Urraca got earlier seemed to favor June). People noted that even mid June can be during the school year for some districts. Both the Middle and the East Kingdom have their big dance events in March, so a March KWDS would kill those events for 2015. A lot of people planned to make it a longer vacation. They said that although they would appreciate knowing what other SCA events would be happening before or after KWDS,
 they would not consider going to two SCA events a priority for scheduling. A number of people would be bringing spouses or children who would not be taking dance classes, but they felt that they could find their own entertainment without needed the event to plan activities for them. A lot of people liked the idea of booking beds in the hostel and using it for classes and social space. People said that while they would appreciate food at the event, if it is going to mean too much work, they would be fine without food. A list of restaurants that would be good for people who don't speak German would be helpful. Musicians asked if there would be any possibility of using loaner instruments, rather than having to fly with them. There were questions about the scope of the classes (such as, do Drachenwalders do country dances?) since the class lists for Academia della Danza seem to focus on 15th century. In general, people were very positive about the idea of
 having the event in Germany.

KWDMS in 2017: Yves said that there is talk in Meridies of either Atlanta or Nashville in 2017.? Atlanta is a major airline hub.?

?? Phillip White suggested we have some sort of ongoing means of soliciting and scheduling classes. Just as Gwommy has been able to set up a web site that can be used in future years, someone could be in charge of classes without being local to the group hosting the event.? Urraca said that running KWDMS like a Worldcon could have some advantages, but deciding who gets to be on the committee controlling it could be a political can of worms. People suggested having a mailing list to talk about KWDMS planning, like the Pennsic Dance list, instead. Urraca suggested setting up a forum attached to the website. Gwommy didn't want to do that. Urraca said she would set up a Yahoo mailing list.

--Urraca Yriarte de Gamboa

From david.a.learmonth at gmail.com  Wed Jun 26 01:24:12 2013
From: david.a.learmonth at gmail.com (David Learmonth)
Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2013 01:24:12 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] kwdms wrap-up
In-Reply-To: <CADxf9vKihcyeYqXBEz4R8TanXnkOCkoCANp-edWZxj2BiZLXxQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BLU173-W1708832EA7B0C892873B0EC5960@phx.gbl>
	<1372214542.40778.YahooMailNeo@web121802.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
	<CADxf9vKihcyeYqXBEz4R8TanXnkOCkoCANp-edWZxj2BiZLXxQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CADxf9vKpT6pVoDMhd-RsR=KgsGpWbVzkj5Er-YFQPSwWWu-1oQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jun 26, 2013 at 1:22 AM, David Learmonth <
david.a.learmonth at gmail.com> wrote:

> Thanks Urraca for the recap!
>
> Fun event, I learned stuff.  :)
>
> I just wanted to say though, that the website can't do it all for you.  In
> my personal opinion, the reality is that you have to communicate directly,
> set deadlines, and do Personal Followups (via email, and sometimes
> telephone too).
>
> I know we've all been teachers, and that we know that the event is coming
> up.  But you'd be surprised how much direct pushing can help to meet
> deadlines, and encourage submissions.
>
> But I wasn't a teacher this time, so I did not see all the emails.  This
> was just my impression, from seeing delays in posting responses to
> questions, etc.  It is Not an easy job, it is very time consuming, for
> multiple people involved in the event, to manage all the teachers and
> information coming in, and all the questions.  Fortunately, a good number
> of these questions, say, for Germany and onwards, Can be answered
> potentially as soon as possible, at least with caveats of being
> "tentative", if we are waiting for bid approvals and such.  (and the hope
> is that the website will help be this resource for information, with the
> FAQ and such)
>
> Oh, and yeah, I've always felt that with so many classes, it isn't really
> preferable at this particular event to have a Ball List based too heavily
> on the Classes, because people aren't going to be able to make all the
> classes, and many people are going to want to practice dances before hand,
> so that they are prepared.  Really, the Ball Lists are something that could
> potentially be done quite early, even a year in advance, and one could just
> leave a few spots open to be filled in later with a few highlight dances
> from classes being taught.
> (NOTE:  This is something that I learned from 2009.  I know that our ball
> lists were also fairly late in the game, and I realized later that they
> don't need to be.  We just had our delays, and they were lower priority at
> the time, but certainly something that could be looked at way ahead of
> time, before things get even busier.)
>
> Other than that, yeah, there was a lot of info that didn't get out to
> everyone.  I was pleasantly surprised that i Sebastiani was performing at
> the Ball.  However, I was shocked that this was not announced more widely.
>  I think you'd be surprised how many people would have been excited by this
> news, and how it may have drawn in additional attendees!  (I did hear from
> a few people who did find out, and that was part of the reason they came)
>
> Last thing here for now, is that regarding putting together a Class
> Schedule, it can be difficult to have one ready too long before the event,
> as much as one would like.  I am not certain how early previous ones had
> it.  I think we had it within a week before, because of changes with last
> minute cancellations and such.  Perhaps it can be reasonably together, just
> that there will be a few changes that are hard to predict until the day of.
>  I'm glad that they had a board to post changes, that is always useful.
>
> Good luck on the next ones!  Germany, and then Meridies / Ansteorra
> perhaps!
> Darius
>
>
> On Tue, Jun 25, 2013 at 10:42 PM, Mary Railing <mrailing2 at yahoo.com>wrote:
>
>> These are my (not always coherent) notes from the wrap-up meeting:
>>
>> Good things
>>    The Renaissonics: They were thrilled to come. We were thrilled to have
>> them. Grant money from the corporation was used to pay them ($250 a person
>> plus expenses). There is a grant from Master Christopher Darras [sp?]
>> available for bringing professionals to teach at KWDMS.
>>    The music classes: The coordinator asked for suggestions of what
>> people wanted to learn. Therefore there were good, well-attended classes.
>>    Food:  There was a good food Friday and Saturday, including vegan.
>> Deonna liked that she could tell them what she was looking for, and they
>> knew just what to do.
>>    Pick up bands: Johannes liked being able to play in the pick-up band.
>> He would have liked more practice time, but that was a scheduling issue.
>>    Web site: Gwommy made user-friendly web site.
>>    Most people liked the long breaks between classes. They were necessary
>> to go between buildings. There was some discussion regarding the optimal
>> number of tracks and class periods.
>>
>> Not so good
>>     Lost the  Middle Eastern track.
>>    There was a practice room with sheet music available, but most people
>> didn't know about it. It would have been better to have had the music
>> available before the event, so people could practice it, but Deonna didn't
>> have enough advance info on ball sets.
>>    The ball sets needed modification. Do not need to have every dance
>> that was taught in the ball.
>>    People would have liked more class info on the web sooner. Knowing
>> what classes were on which day would be helpful for someone trying to
>> decide if they should skip work to go on Friday. People liked having
>> aerobic level and complexity level listed, although that had been a
>> controversial suggestion previously.
>>    Proceedings: There weren't a lot of contributions. The editor wants to
>> add class handouts to the electronic version. Important to set early
>> deadlines and then ask people personally. APhillip lot seems to depend on
>> who knows who. Deonna noted that there is only so much one can do to inform
>> people about deadlines People need to read the web site.
>>
>> Drachenwald in 2015: Urraca described Countess Judith's proposal for a
>> KWDMS in Miltenberg, Germany. The site would be the Altes Rathaus (city
>> hall) which has been used for dance events before. There is also a nearby
>> hostel, which could be used for classes as well as lodging. The biggest
>> variable is the date. Their kingdom's dance event is usually held in March,
>> which is when Judith would prefer, but KWDMS is usually in June or early
>> July. People in the room seemed pretty evenly split as to which month they
>> would prefer (although comments Urraca got earlier seemed to favor June).
>> People noted that even mid June can be during the school year for some
>> districts. Both the Middle and the East Kingdom have their big dance events
>> in March, so a March KWDS would kill those events for 2015. A lot of people
>> planned to make it a longer vacation. They said that although they would
>> appreciate knowing what other SCA events would be happening before or after
>> KWDS,
>>  they would not consider going to two SCA events a priority for
>> scheduling. A number of people would be bringing spouses or children who
>> would not be taking dance classes, but they felt that they could find their
>> own entertainment without needed the event to plan activities for them. A
>> lot of people liked the idea of booking beds in the hostel and using it for
>> classes and social space. People said that while they would appreciate food
>> at the event, if it is going to mean too much work, they would be fine
>> without food. A list of restaurants that would be good for people who don't
>> speak German would be helpful. Musicians asked if there would be any
>> possibility of using loaner instruments, rather than having to fly with
>> them. There were questions about the scope of the classes (such as, do
>> Drachenwalders do country dances?) since the class lists for Academia della
>> Danza seem to focus on 15th century. In general, people were very positive
>> about the idea of
>>  having the event in Germany.
>>
>> KWDMS in 2017: Yves said that there is talk in Meridies of either Atlanta
>> or Nashville in 2017.  Atlanta is a major airline hub.
>>
>>    Phillip White suggested we have some sort of ongoing means of
>> soliciting and scheduling classes. Just as Gwommy has been able to set up a
>> web site that can be used in future years, someone could be in charge of
>> classes without being local to the group hosting the event.  Urraca said
>> that running KWDMS like a Worldcon could have some advantages, but deciding
>> who gets to be on the committee controlling it could be a political can of
>> worms. People suggested having a mailing list to talk about KWDMS planning,
>> like the Pennsic Dance list, instead. Urraca suggested setting up a forum
>> attached to the website. Gwommy didn't want to do that. Urraca said she
>> would set up a Yahoo mailing list.
>>
>> --Urraca Yriarte de Gamboa
>> ________________________________________________________________
>> To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is
>> listed
>> in the To line of any response.
>>
>> To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
>>
>> Posting guidlines on the list info page:
>> https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
>> ________________________________________________________________
>>
>
>

From charlene281 at gmail.com  Wed Jun 26 16:47:56 2013
From: charlene281 at gmail.com (Charlene C)
Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2013 15:47:56 -0500
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Bassedanses
In-Reply-To: <CAO26FW25321QBoCf7UsCNTkzAgWqKhL-EyMkKKH4Q+yA1hVaxQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306241052100.4348@panix3.panix.com>
	<Pine.NEB.4.64.1306241416320.2349@panix2.panix.com>
	<CAO26FW25321QBoCf7UsCNTkzAgWqKhL-EyMkKKH4Q+yA1hVaxQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAHUFDpP3-dZLES4Xdnc=wSS62T9ud=5spHGtkLDh+of3gypVyw@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Jun 24, 2013 at 2:50 PM, Justin du coeur <jducoeur at gmail.com> wrote:

>
> So if we seem to consistently find Burgundian dance dull, that sings out to
> me that we're doing *something* wrong.  Could be the reconstructions; could
> be that we're being too rigid in the interpretations of the style, not
> giving ourselves enough latitude to mess around; might even be that our
> *mindset* is simply wrong -- we might be over-thinking dances that were
> deliberately simple so that people could socialize during them.
>

Tastes do change. There's a discussion right now on the MECD list about how
the dance repetoire has changed radically in the last 40-50 years because
folks like different dances now.

--Perronnelle

From bwebb at inf.ed.ac.uk  Tue Jun 25 13:25:19 2013
From: bwebb at inf.ed.ac.uk (Barbara Webb)
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2013 18:25:19 +0100 (BST)
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Bassedances
In-Reply-To: <mailman.411.1372176040.28492.sca-dance@sca-dance.org>
References: <mailman.411.1372176040.28492.sca-dance@sca-dance.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.LRH.2.02.1306251809510.5686@windgassen.inf.ed.ac.uk>


I have a feeling I've said this before, but nearly everyone in our dance 
group likes bassedances for the following reason: instead of teaching one 
(or a few) bassedance as a choreography, we instead teach the underlying 
formula common to all the dances, and then end each dance practice by 
random choice of one dance from the sources. If you are familiar with the 
formula, it takes about 30 seconds to 'learn' and do this new dance. At 
the same time our musicians have their own formulas for improvising on the 
tenor, so we are dancing a new dance to a novel on-the-spot composition.
What could be uninteresting about that?

While there is no direct evidence that this is what they did in period, it 
is suggestive that the instruction manuals are set out more or less in 
this way, i.e. introducing the underlying structural elements before 
listing the specific patterns for each dance with a tenor line of music.

Caitlin


-- 
The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in
Scotland, with registration number SC005336.


From ianthe at gmail.com  Wed Jun 26 10:03:17 2013
From: ianthe at gmail.com (Nadine)
Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2013 09:03:17 -0500
Subject: [SCA-Dance] KWDMS and video from the event
Message-ID: <CAHbX47nsCnHcbTm5EEQcZ9D9pVQBnnq0x38ytJREfz1y8LvFVQ@mail.gmail.com>

It was a really fabulous event. I enjoyed the balls, and the after midnight
balls. One of the nights I stayed up till 5 am :)

Managed to wake up for the Il Papa class that was taught by Daniele and
Roselyne, and Gwommy's how to remember dances class, both were great.

I also got to teach a Canary class and didn't break anyone ;-)

My favorite moments from the balls were: doing Ly Bens as part of a giant
ameoba, I laughed so hard my cheeks hurt. And dancing the epic 10 minute
galliard with my talented dance partner, Felice!

So I took some videos during the ball, there was a section of time where
people could show off their reconstructed dances. (Don't be too excited
about the videos, it was just taken on an iPhone)

Maurin, Caelia and Thyra danced Allegreza d'Amore:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBnjSzFkfrg&feature=youtu.be

It was also the dance that won the reconstruction performance competition.

I also took a iphone videos of Daniele and Roselyne and their daughter's Il
Papa? reconstructed dance, and Trahern and Sara's dance. Dancers, let me
know if you want them uploaded.

Big thanks to the organizers!

Yay! Dancing!

Lowrie.




-- 
http://nadinestudio.com

From judithsca at aol.com  Wed Jun 26 12:18:19 2013
From: judithsca at aol.com (Rachel/Judith)
Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2013 12:18:19 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Sca-dance Digest, Vol 92, Issue 11: Survey on KWDMS
In-Reply-To: <mailman.353.1372262435.5767.sca-dance@sca-dance.org>
References: <mailman.353.1372262435.5767.sca-dance@sca-dance.org>
Message-ID: <8D0409FE7D896BB-11A8-24038@webmail-m101.sysops.aol.com>


Salvete!

In response to the discussion of KWDMS 2015, I have compiled an initial survey to gather information. It can be found here:

http://de.surveymonkey.com/s/SG8GFGK


Feedback is aprpeciated, and please share with anyone you think might have input!

Judith

p.s. Click on "Fertig" to finish the survey.



From felicedebbage at gmail.com  Wed Jun 26 17:12:13 2013
From: felicedebbage at gmail.com (Felice Debbage)
Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2013 17:12:13 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance]  Gracca Amorosa Flash Mob at Pennsic War (Tuesday,
 July 30, 12pm)
Message-ID: <CAGaFKxSYBrnv=s9Rm=3rqObZZQg3RhDob60-mfSV-rj-DTygRg@mail.gmail.com>

Greetings, Dance Enthusiasts,
You all are invited to participate in a "Gracca Amorosa" flashmob at this
year's Pennsic War! Meet at noon on Tues., 7/30 in the wide, grassy south
merchant area near the main gate for the flashmob. (This is the space near
Raymond's Quiet Press, the vending machines, etc., just south of that main
road that leads right up to Troll. There's a very large tree just south of
the grassy spot.) We will probably start the "show" at about 12:15pm, but
there will be "planted" musicians there starting around 11:50ish. If you
want to just show up and participate, act "normal" and go shopping nearby
or hang out with friends on the grass. But look at each other, and do not
stare at the musicians or the space where the action will happen. You could
act amused when Felice and Luther start dancing, but it will look
impressive if you can gradually "start" watching them after a few rounds.
The key thing to remember is that unless I've told you otherwise, you will
start dancing or playing after the "random pickup dancers and musicians"
have done the dance one time through. Then, you can join in as we repeat
the dance from the beginning. Afterwards, take a quick reverenza with your
partner, and just walk away like nothing strange ever happened at all. ;-)
You can invite anybody else you want, so long as they know the dance and
know how long to wait before joining in.

Don't know the dance, "Gracca Amorosa"? I am teaching a class on it Monday,
July 29, at 10 am in the dance tent. We will learn all the moves and
practice how to start the flashmob so you'll look like a pro when we
perform it for the lucky folks who happen to be strolling by. Musicians who
can play the song well are welcome, too! If you need sheet music,
contact Gebhard
von Lozengia<http://www.facebook.com/gebhard.vonlozengia?directed_target_id=219975508061504>,
at dcrackel at gmail.com.

Questions? E-mail me at felicedebbage at gmail.com, message me on facebook,
where I'm Sarah Joseph Cordingley (Felice Debbage), or join the Middle
Kingdom Dance Enthusiasts group, which is where I will post any changes or
additional information.
-- 
Good dancing to you!

Mistress Felice Debbage

From mrio at umich.edu  Wed Jun 26 17:34:40 2013
From: mrio at umich.edu (Monique Rio)
Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2013 17:34:40 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance]  Bassedanses
Message-ID: <CAPY5N8Vq3TJR9aT_CJSCCLKAg0ph2oSm1+S-0qkRXP0wKW329w@mail.gmail.com>

I totally agree with Justin. People are people. If a dance is hard to
learn /and/ dull either we're doing it wrong or missing some context.

I suspect a fair amount of the problem people have with bassedanse is
with the music. Recordings have embellished upper lines that dancers
struggle to ignore. Musicians struggle to resist the urge to play the
written out, more exciting non-melody lines when playing the dance.

It's something I've been wanting to work on for a while.

-Jadzia

On Mon, Jun 24, 2013 at 3:50 PM, Justin du coeur <jducoeur at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Jun 24, 2013 at 2:20 PM, D. Peters <dpeters at panix.com> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 24 Jun 2013, Tim McDaniel wrote:
>>
>> > Did someone find a magic spell to make Burgundian basse dances
>> > interesting?
>>
>> Actually, I've *always* found Burgundian bassedanses interesting--but I'm
>> more of a musician than a dancer, and I love fifteenth-century
>> instrumental music.  The first time that I saw Casseulle, danced to a
>> four-part Spagna setting, I was hooked :-)
>>
>> (And it's always seemed to me that an imaginative dancer can make just
>> about any type of dance interesting, in any case....)
>
>
> Actually, this raises an interesting question: why *do* we seem to disagree
> with our period forebears about Burgundian dance?
>
> This ties into one of my commonplace observations about period: people are
> basically people, and period people weren't *that* different from us.  For
> example, my rule of thumb in cooking is that, if my reconstructed recipe
> tastes vile, I probably did it wrong.  Of course, I don't judge that solely
> by myself -- tastes vary -- but if *everybody* thinks it's vile then I'm
> pretty suspicious.  I almost always find an alternate interpretation that
> works better.
>
> The same logic seems to apply for dance.  While there were many subtle
> forces in period dance, by and large people did it because it was
> enjoyable.  I've seen little evidence that dances tended to survive if they
> weren't at least *somewhat* fun.
>
> So if we seem to consistently find Burgundian dance dull, that sings out to
> me that we're doing *something* wrong.  Could be the reconstructions; could
> be that we're being too rigid in the interpretations of the style, not
> giving ourselves enough latitude to mess around; might even be that our
> *mindset* is simply wrong -- we might be over-thinking dances that were
> deliberately simple so that people could socialize during them.
>
> I'm honestly unsure what the answer is here.  It just occurs to me that
> these dances are attested by several different period manuals, so we have
> good reason to believe they were popular.  If that's the case, then I have
> to believe that the period dancers didn't find them a chore.  So if we *do*
> find them dishpan-dull, we're probably doing something wrong...
> ________________________________________________________________
> To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
> in the To line of any response.
>
> To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
>
> Posting guidlines on the list info page: https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
> ________________________________________________________________

From yves.de.fortanier at comcast.net  Wed Jun 26 22:46:54 2013
From: yves.de.fortanier at comcast.net (Yves de Fortanier)
Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2013 22:46:54 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Bassedanses
In-Reply-To: <CAPY5N8Vq3TJR9aT_CJSCCLKAg0ph2oSm1+S-0qkRXP0wKW329w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPY5N8Vq3TJR9aT_CJSCCLKAg0ph2oSm1+S-0qkRXP0wKW329w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00a801ce72e0$958a9090$c09fb1b0$@comcast.net>

Bonjour from Yves,

Whoever the Cool People are, if they dance, others will follow. In the Old
Days, more of the Cool People danced, so there was more people dancing
overall, yes? At least that was the case here in Meridies.

Consider the following. A good speaker can succeed with mediocre text. A
poor speaker can't succeed even with superb text.

Likewise with dancing. A superb, engaging teacher, I think, could encourage
people to enjoy and want to do a simple basse danse like Le Mois de May -
or, a dance even more trivial, the Quadran Pavin.

Comments?



From david.a.learmonth at gmail.com  Thu Jun 27 01:17:38 2013
From: david.a.learmonth at gmail.com (David Learmonth)
Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 01:17:38 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Bassedanses
In-Reply-To: <00a801ce72e0$958a9090$c09fb1b0$@comcast.net>
References: <CAPY5N8Vq3TJR9aT_CJSCCLKAg0ph2oSm1+S-0qkRXP0wKW329w@mail.gmail.com>
	<00a801ce72e0$958a9090$c09fb1b0$@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <CADxf9vJh-jNNHpssfV2_oxehtxrxfaZ3cGYv8tNX94-n7iCUQw@mail.gmail.com>

I had mentioned to Jadzia that for a few years now I've been meaning to
also give serious pursuit to Bassedanses, to give it a shot and see if I
could help make it part of the common repertoire more-so, and at least to
get better at them myself.  Perhaps I'll finally have time to look at this,
now that we're past many of the major events for the moment.  :)

But just in response, I wanted to say that, I actually haven't had too much
trouble bringing most styles of dance to the average person who has some
interest in dance, and to make it interesting or exciting, or at least to
discuss the benefits of it to us in a modern sense, and/or in a historical
context.  However, bringing it to the non-dancing populace has proven
difficult in our kingdom (Ealdormere).  Even with some Kings and Barons
supporting it, it seems to just no longer be part of the culture.  And
sadly, most Ealdormereans did not attend KWDS when it was up this way, so
they couldn't see how awesome Dancing can be.  :(

Darius




On Wed, Jun 26, 2013 at 10:46 PM, Yves de Fortanier <
yves.de.fortanier at comcast.net> wrote:

> Bonjour from Yves,
>
> Whoever the Cool People are, if they dance, others will follow. In the Old
> Days, more of the Cool People danced, so there was more people dancing
> overall, yes? At least that was the case here in Meridies.
>
> Consider the following. A good speaker can succeed with mediocre text. A
> poor speaker can't succeed even with superb text.
>
> Likewise with dancing. A superb, engaging teacher, I think, could encourage
> people to enjoy and want to do a simple basse danse like Le Mois de May -
> or, a dance even more trivial, the Quadran Pavin.
>
> Comments?
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
> in the To line of any response.
>
> To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
>
> Posting guidlines on the list info page:
> https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
> ________________________________________________________________
>

From david.a.learmonth at gmail.com  Thu Jun 27 01:21:24 2013
From: david.a.learmonth at gmail.com (David Learmonth)
Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 01:21:24 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Gracca Amorosa Flash Mob at Pennsic War (Tuesday,
 July 30, 12pm)
In-Reply-To: <CAGaFKxSYBrnv=s9Rm=3rqObZZQg3RhDob60-mfSV-rj-DTygRg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGaFKxSYBrnv=s9Rm=3rqObZZQg3RhDob60-mfSV-rj-DTygRg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CADxf9vJuzZANK4xkVPzpSe2KS_35XDZHG3UxP=88DYsHei2c=g@mail.gmail.com>

Fabulous idea Felice, good luck with it!  Let's make dance more visible and
fun!  :)

Darius


On Wed, Jun 26, 2013 at 5:12 PM, Felice Debbage <felicedebbage at gmail.com>wrote:

> Greetings, Dance Enthusiasts,
> You all are invited to participate in a "Gracca Amorosa" flashmob at this
> year's Pennsic War! Meet at noon on Tues., 7/30 in the wide, grassy south
> merchant area near the main gate for the flashmob. (This is the space near
> Raymond's Quiet Press, the vending machines, etc., just south of that main
> road that leads right up to Troll. There's a very large tree just south of
> the grassy spot.) We will probably start the "show" at about 12:15pm, but
> there will be "planted" musicians there starting around 11:50ish. If you
> want to just show up and participate, act "normal" and go shopping nearby
> or hang out with friends on the grass. But look at each other, and do not
> stare at the musicians or the space where the action will happen. You could
> act amused when Felice and Luther start dancing, but it will look
> impressive if you can gradually "start" watching them after a few rounds.
> The key thing to remember is that unless I've told you otherwise, you will
> start dancing or playing after the "random pickup dancers and musicians"
> have done the dance one time through. Then, you can join in as we repeat
> the dance from the beginning. Afterwards, take a quick reverenza with your
> partner, and just walk away like nothing strange ever happened at all. ;-)
> You can invite anybody else you want, so long as they know the dance and
> know how long to wait before joining in.
>
> Don't know the dance, "Gracca Amorosa"? I am teaching a class on it Monday,
> July 29, at 10 am in the dance tent. We will learn all the moves and
> practice how to start the flashmob so you'll look like a pro when we
> perform it for the lucky folks who happen to be strolling by. Musicians who
> can play the song well are welcome, too! If you need sheet music,
> contact Gebhard
> von Lozengia<
> http://www.facebook.com/gebhard.vonlozengia?directed_target_id=219975508061504
> >,
> at dcrackel at gmail.com.
>
> Questions? E-mail me at felicedebbage at gmail.com, message me on facebook,
> where I'm Sarah Joseph Cordingley (Felice Debbage), or join the Middle
> Kingdom Dance Enthusiasts group, which is where I will post any changes or
> additional information.
> --
> Good dancing to you!
>
> Mistress Felice Debbage
> ________________________________________________________________
> To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
> in the To line of any response.
>
> To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
>
> Posting guidlines on the list info page:
> https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
> ________________________________________________________________
>

From marianne at historiaviva.org  Thu Jun 27 04:27:46 2013
From: marianne at historiaviva.org (Marianne Perdomo)
Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 09:27:46 +0100
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Bassedances
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LRH.2.02.1306251809510.5686@windgassen.inf.ed.ac.uk>
References: <mailman.411.1372176040.28492.sca-dance@sca-dance.org>
	<alpine.LRH.2.02.1306251809510.5686@windgassen.inf.ed.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <CAMMYS2Gc0r=-2dBBR_kwzPa+mBMvsQPaeFdQ7frEWiekPcbcnA@mail.gmail.com>

I can vouch for that. And to me the very fact that there were special terms
to describe them means that it was done very similarly in period.

Also, I think people nowadays often miss the whole original point of
socializing, showing yourself and looking at others, being next to people
of the opposite sex (or whatever). Also to me there's just the sheer joy of
having a number of people moving in unison. Looked ad it that way even the
simplest branle has great charm.

Cheers!

Leonor

From xcvii at alum.mit.edu  Thu Jun 27 15:05:09 2013
From: xcvii at alum.mit.edu (Troy Daniels)
Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 15:05:09 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Gracca Amorosa Flash Mob at Pennsic War (Tuesday,
 July 30, 12pm)
In-Reply-To: <CAGaFKxSYBrnv=s9Rm=3rqObZZQg3RhDob60-mfSV-rj-DTygRg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGaFKxSYBrnv=s9Rm=3rqObZZQg3RhDob60-mfSV-rj-DTygRg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALSS3zPBZ8DBiVtJVKS1UUnm9y7qE73ycZyybPncL7WQRTEv2Q@mail.gmail.com>

Any special instructions for the musicians?

Udalrich


On Wed, Jun 26, 2013 at 5:12 PM, Felice Debbage <felicedebbage at gmail.com>wrote:

> Greetings, Dance Enthusiasts,
> You all are invited to participate in a "Gracca Amorosa" flashmob at this
> year's Pennsic War! Meet at noon on Tues., 7/30 in the wide, grassy south
> merchant area near the main gate for the flashmob. (This is the space near
> Raymond's Quiet Press, the vending machines, etc., just south of that main
> road that leads right up to Troll. There's a very large tree just south of
> the grassy spot.) We will probably start the "show" at about 12:15pm, but
> there will be "planted" musicians there starting around 11:50ish. If you
> want to just show up and participate, act "normal" and go shopping nearby
> or hang out with friends on the grass. But look at each other, and do not
> stare at the musicians or the space where the action will happen. You could
> act amused when Felice and Luther start dancing, but it will look
> impressive if you can gradually "start" watching them after a few rounds.
> The key thing to remember is that unless I've told you otherwise, you will
> start dancing or playing after the "random pickup dancers and musicians"
> have done the dance one time through. Then, you can join in as we repeat
> the dance from the beginning. Afterwards, take a quick reverenza with your
> partner, and just walk away like nothing strange ever happened at all. ;-)
> You can invite anybody else you want, so long as they know the dance and
> know how long to wait before joining in.
>
> Don't know the dance, "Gracca Amorosa"? I am teaching a class on it Monday,
> July 29, at 10 am in the dance tent. We will learn all the moves and
> practice how to start the flashmob so you'll look like a pro when we
> perform it for the lucky folks who happen to be strolling by. Musicians who
> can play the song well are welcome, too! If you need sheet music,
> contact Gebhard
> von Lozengia<
> http://www.facebook.com/gebhard.vonlozengia?directed_target_id=219975508061504
> >,
> at dcrackel at gmail.com.
>
> Questions? E-mail me at felicedebbage at gmail.com, message me on facebook,
> where I'm Sarah Joseph Cordingley (Felice Debbage), or join the Middle
> Kingdom Dance Enthusiasts group, which is where I will post any changes or
> additional information.
> --
> Good dancing to you!
>
> Mistress Felice Debbage
> ________________________________________________________________
> To send mail to the entire list, be sure sca-dance at sca-dance.org is listed
> in the To line of any response.
>
> To Unsubscribe send mail to: sca-dance-request at sca-dance.org
>
> Posting guidlines on the list info page:
> https://lists.andrew.cmu.edu/mailman/listinfo/sca-dance
> ________________________________________________________________
>

From dpeters at panix.com  Thu Jun 27 15:17:08 2013
From: dpeters at panix.com (D. Peters)
Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 15:17:08 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [SCA-Dance]  Gracca Amorosa Flash Mob at Pennsic War (Tuesday,
 July 30, 12pm)
In-Reply-To: <CAGaFKxSYBrnv=s9Rm=3rqObZZQg3RhDob60-mfSV-rj-DTygRg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGaFKxSYBrnv=s9Rm=3rqObZZQg3RhDob60-mfSV-rj-DTygRg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.64.1306271511350.20224@panix2.panix.com>

On Wed, 26 Jun 2013, Felice Debbage wrote:

> You all are invited to participate in a "Gracca Amorosa" flashmob at this
> year's Pennsic War! Meet at noon on Tues., 7/30....

Darn--that's exactly the same time as a class I'm teaching :-(

<plug>If you're a musician, and you aren't going to the flash mob, I hope 
you'll come to my class:  we'll be playing Mass movements from various 
composers' settings of _Missa l'Homme Arme_ </plug>

And now we return you to your regularly scheduled dance listserv :-)

Cheers--
Rufina/DP

"Some musicians really fall in love with an instrument and want to live in
the sound of it, but I am more the kind of musician who loves a type of
music and will shamelessly bang away on whatever will get me to that kind
of music...."
      --Shira Kammen

From wrborn at hotmail.com  Sun Jun 30 14:44:41 2013
From: wrborn at hotmail.com (William Bornander)
Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2013 14:44:41 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] FW:  Bassedances
In-Reply-To: <CAMMYS2Em9DYtDEQ54Wrc5KKCL8AL+VEqm5SZ=v3grt6m39Ky7A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.411.1372176040.28492.sca-dance@sca-dance.org>,
	<alpine.LRH.2.02.1306251809510.5686@windgassen.inf.ed.ac.uk>,
	<CAMMYS2Gc0r=-2dBBR_kwzPa+mBMvsQPaeFdQ7frEWiekPcbcnA@mail.gmail.com>,
	<BAY167-W3348825ADC7D2E2D5C3645DB700@phx.gbl>,
	<CAMMYS2Em9DYtDEQ54Wrc5KKCL8AL+VEqm5SZ=v3grt6m39Ky7A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY167-W2252ECAAE3DBBB0BEDA114DB700@phx.gbl>




Forgive the delay in my comments (as I am still
not KWDS recovered) but I have found differing things with the Basse.

 

The locals here ask for
it and stress they want to learn and internalise it. I personally do not think
that Basse was primarily all about "socializing, showing yourself and looking at others, being next
to people of the opposite sex (or whatever)" but rather that it
was about showing that one was noble. That was a BIG DEAL in the early renaissance and the form really
gives the chance to show that off...

 

I once was a hater but
now find them to be great fun. My personal beef was the memory needed but as
others have said one needs to learn the base patterns first then the rest is
easy.

 

There was a description
offered on list of a group that just does a random basse at the end of the
practice. I offer that this was potentially part of the reason they were popular
in period. One could have guests from far away quickly do a local favorite
without discomfort. The line of couples also allows it`s sharing as those who
know the music and form could easily follow gracefully...

 

Just adding my 2 cents...

 

Wilhelm

 
 		 	   		  

From john.white at drexel.edu  Sun Jun 30 17:26:41 2013
From: john.white at drexel.edu (White,John)
Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2013 21:26:41 +0000
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Bassedances
Message-ID: <6CEF9498CE7F2A4AB4B8F0CD27CB36D204AABC@MB4.drexel.edu>

I find Burgundian Bassedances to be both (relatively) easy and fun.  Part of the fun, for me, comes
from doing it correctly - counting properly and ending when the music ends.  I was taught many years
ago, and so have been doing the steps for quite a while, which helps some.  It is still quite easy to 
lose count.

Though my teacher was quite accomplished, we always used the same music for the one dance we
constantly did which ended up giving us cues as to what was supposed to happen when.  Still, the
particular dance we did, Thorin, was one of the long ones (51313), so having those cues helped to
learn the parts well.  I have been able to move beyond that one piece and while I wouldn't want to
try one in a competition, I think I'm pretty good at the form.  

If I ever get a practice back, I think I will make it a point to teach the form more often.

           \\Dafydd C

From yves.de.fortanier at comcast.net  Sun Jun 30 17:43:11 2013
From: yves.de.fortanier at comcast.net (Yves de Fortanier)
Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2013 17:43:11 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Bassedances
In-Reply-To: <6CEF9498CE7F2A4AB4B8F0CD27CB36D204AABC@MB4.drexel.edu>
References: <6CEF9498CE7F2A4AB4B8F0CD27CB36D204AABC@MB4.drexel.edu>
Message-ID: <001101ce75da$d26110a0$772331e0$@comcast.net>

For those interested in this topic, I have an article online.

http://www.peterdur.com/kwds2007/proceedings/Another-Look-at-Fifteenth-Centu
ry-Burgundian-Basse-Dance.htm

Suggestions for improving this article are welcome. PDF also available.

Cordially,
Yves




From wrborn at hotmail.com  Sun Jun 30 18:42:29 2013
From: wrborn at hotmail.com (William Bornander)
Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2013 18:42:29 -0400
Subject: [SCA-Dance] Bassedances
In-Reply-To: <6CEF9498CE7F2A4AB4B8F0CD27CB36D204AABC@MB4.drexel.edu>
References: <6CEF9498CE7F2A4AB4B8F0CD27CB36D204AABC@MB4.drexel.edu>
Message-ID: <BAY167-W46753F23E42C1B4F6A857FDB700@phx.gbl>

"we always used the same music for the one dance we constantly did which ended up giving us cues as to what was supposed to happen when. "
My most recent theory on the music is that the musical phrase of the top lines (improved or not) would have ended with the dance phrase. The manuscript sources could have been used as is for musicians who were able to improv to see where those phrases were (and the tenor  could have helped a musician keep his place.) I have been intentionally teaching with the specific music that repeats the same close on the Demarche. That has helped the dancers immensely. Another "trick" I have used was to dance the basse just to the tenor. (I THINK that might be more applicable for the Bassedanza in the Italian tradition then Burgundian.
Again...just my thoughts,Wilhelm 		 	   		  

From judithsca at aol.com  Thu Jun 27 05:07:54 2013
From: judithsca at aol.com (Rachel/Judith)
Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 09:07:54 -0000
Subject: [SCA-Dance] SCA-Dance: KWDMS survey updated
Message-ID: <8D0412CEEF54931-16E0-36270@webmail-d272.sysops.aol.com>


Salvete! I have updated the survey to allow for more detailed answers if people wish:

http://de.surveymonkey.com/s/SG8GFGK

Again, please share with anyone might be interested!

Judith